difference between ni,he and de particle
  • hi all,
    can somebody help me in understanding where to use ni,he and de particle.
  • Posted By: abhi
    [p]hi all,
    can somebody help me in understanding where to use ni,he and de particle.[/p]

    Buy a book.

    No but seriously, particles are one of the hardest parts to grasp in the Japanese language. Either you study them and all the exceptions for a long time... or you leave it to context and learn it as you go (which will take a very very long time).

    Here's the basics:
    へ - Direction. Can only be used with a place and a verb which will be done towards that place. Possibly the easiest particle in the Japanese language.
    に - Probably the hardest particle in Japanese, it can be used in TONS of situations and the meaning varies a lot. Also, any へ can be replaced by a に, but the opposite isn't true.
    で - Also very versitile. Can be used as a "by" particle. For example, how did you get to school? 電車で - (BY train). Can also be used to indicate where a verb takes place (some verbs use で and some verbs use に to indicate where it's being done. It's almost impossible to know when to use what, but verbs using で are often an active and temporary verb.)
  • suppose for example:-

    kono pen wa nihon de kaimasu.
    watashiwa raigetsu nihon e ikimasu.
    watashiwa raigetsu nihon ni ikimasu.
    is all of them are correct?
    the major confusing part is "place +he/ni+ verb". in this case which one to use he or ni.
    i can guess here de particle depends upon the verb used???????
  • このペンは日本で買ったペンです - if you where attempting to say "this is a pen I bought in Japan" However you would probably leave out the "このペンは" part because it's pointless to bring up the topic if it's obvious from the context.

    このペンは日本で買います - would mean "this is a pen that's bought in japan" however without context you wouldn't now if it's a pen you have in your posession or if it's a picture or something your looking at. I think it's grammatically correct, but it seems like typical quirky textbook japanese. Japanese verb forms are a bit hard to grasp and even at intermediate level students often have problem using the right tense for verbs.

    私は来月日本へ行きます 
    私は来月日本に行きます

    both these are fine and like Tobberoth pointed out へ can be freely substituted with に but not the other way around. If you take beginner courses your teacher will probably tell you to use へ and that に is wrong and this is something I've noticed teachers often do because they don't want their students to get confused. However, there are probably sentances in which へ would sound more natural, but all you really need to keep in mind is that へ is a particle that only deals with direction while に is much, much more versatile and annoying :D

    If you're just getting started with Japanese I really recommend that you download and install Japanese language support, and learn hiragana and katakana and some basic Kanji. Also download rikaichan (do a google search if you don't know what i'm talking about) so you can lookup kanji and words you don't understand. If you take it slow, you can learn to read both hiragana and katana in about a month. You can probably manage in about a week if you really get into it and study hard.
  • Posted By: abhi
    [p]suppose for example:-[/p][p]kono pen wa nihon de kaimasu.
    watashiwa raigetsu nihon e ikimasu.
    watashiwa raigetsu nihon ni ikimasu.
    is all of them are correct?
    the major confusing part is "place +he/ni+ verb". in this case which one to use he or ni.
    i can guess here de particle depends upon the verb used???????[/p]

    All of them are grammatically correct, yes.

    My personal rule of thumb is, if I can use へ instead of に in a sentence, I do. I like that for once, a particle does one thing and it does it well, so I like to support it.
    Besides, に has a tendency to be used heavily in sentences, nice to mix things up. そこに行って、お父さんにかわってしたのに、お母さんに褒められなかった。(Even though I went there and did it in place of my dad, I wasn't praised by my mother.) Four に used in one sentence... change the first に to a へ and it sounds less repeative. (Bear in mind, the first に is the only one which can be changed to ha へ in this sentence.)
  • どこで何時に会いましょうか。
    Where (at what place) and when (at what time) shall we meet?

    公園で七時に会いましょう。
    Let's meet at the park at 7 o'clock.

    As a general rule use "de" for at (place) and "ni" for at (time).

    For movement to or from a place, use "he" in formal Japanese / "ni" in everyday language, and "kara".

    To say or give something to a person, use "ni".
  • Strangely, the only one that I'm still having problems with was regarded as "Possibly the easiest particle in the Japanese language." I have my paint brush in Japanese, and when I try to close an untitled work, the following message appears "無題への変更内容を保存しますか?" Why is there this へ in such sentence? It doesn't indicate direction.Is it really necessary?
  • "save changes TO file?"

    TO = へ
  • It's required grammatically, because you can't say 無題にの変更内容.
  • Yeah, but.. 無題 is a no-adjective. Couldn't I just say "無題の変更内容を保存しますか?" I remember I have seen this "への" combination a lot of times, without paying proper attention. Besides, if I consider "へ" as "to", it would become something like "To untitled of". Of course I'm striving not to just translate things. But I can't get the gist of this no-adjective + "への" thing.
  • 無題 is the name of the file. All I can really say to explain it is that there's nothing special about ヘの. It's just 無題へ の 変更内容. If you understand "noun の noun", it's no different to that.

    無題への変更内容を保存しますか? = Save changes to untitled?

    彼へ の 手紙 = A letter to him
    日本で の 活動 = Activity that takes place in Japan
  • I got it, thanks! What happened is that I wasn't realizing that 無題 was the name of the file, and I was treating it as an adjective. Now it makes perfect sense to me.

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